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7 Comments (2 conversations)
Rob Voase
I don’t think Adam is being entirely unfair about Caleb, but he is being a bit disingenuous in putting the lack of a win entirely on Caleb’s play. I quote him here: “Williams might have been good, but he still wasn’t good enough for his team to win in a business built upon winning.”
I’d argue he played well enough to win if the Bears didn’t have so many penalties, the receivers held on to a couple of balls, and the defense had played a bit better. Jahns wants him to play so well that he overcomes those handicaps but its a lot to ask of someone in Year 1 in a complex offense with a lot of inexperienced new weapons.
Steve Anderson
Makes me think of Hoge’s categories of players… Jahns wants/expects Caleb to be in the Red Chip Category, “Players You Win Because Of,” when he’s currently in the Purple Chip Category, “Players You Win With.”
I think it’s okay to have that expectation of the #1 overall pick, who was supposed to be a generational talent, but I think it’s more important that we acknowledge he’s learning to operate an NFL offense after last year’s 2 head coach/3 OC debacle. He played in 21 fewer games than Jayden Daniels and 27 fewer games in college than Bo Nix. I truly believe that he’ll grow into the red chip player, maybe even a blue chip player, but he’s just not there yet. In Ben I trust.
Bob A
I disagree. I think Jahns’ point is we just need him to be average and he was not. He was just “better” than he was in two other games when he was really bad. Also, the QB’s play directly or indirectly affects other aspects, including the defense. If he played better on the two opening drives, the Defense was holding the Ravens down but they were only a TD/Xpoint from taking the lead and Baltimore’s offense played entirely different than they would have if we were up 14. The receivers didn’t drop many passes and I can’t think of one that was just an outright drop. Caleb had almost no touch on passes and when a fastball is thrown behind or too high or too low or too far ahead, even if it hits your hands, those are really difficult catches to make.
Jahns is absolutely correct, we need to stop using such a low bar for Bears QB’s. We did the same thing with Fields for 3 years. Go back and look at almost any post game report for Justin and now for Caleb and we end up talking about things like “there was that one pass in the 1st quarter that shows what he might do” rather than talking about multiple passes that are on time and in structure that any good NFL QB makes routinely. That’s how teams win in the NFL, not the backyard plays that ESPN and Fantasy players love.
Rob Voase
Hi Bob A. Thanks for the reply. It’s good to debate.
I don’t agree with your analysis entirely. He did pay ‘averagely’ with one really egregious play with the interception. Analysis from Matt Waldman. JT O’Sullivan, etc bear that out. And Rome, well as he played, had 3 drops. Should he have caught all three? Maybe not. But not making one is not good enough.
Hoge talks about the idea that he’s not making the same mistakes as Justin did. He’s reading the field, making some decent reads. Justin would stare at open receivers and not throw it.
I am not saying he’s a good QB right now. He has lots to get better on – no doubt. IF he looks like this early next season, then it’s probably time to move on. But it’s too early to say we should be winning because of him right now.
Bob A
Thanks, I agree, honest debate is a good thing. Don’t misunderstand, I’m not completely down on Caleb & the point I’ve been making with Caleb since he was drafted is he doesn’t need to be great. Obviously, it would be tremendous if he was but in the early part of his career we just need him to be solid. Personally, I don’t think he is where he should be yet, doesn’t mean he’ll never get there but he hasn’t given me reason to think he’s progressing steadily. If he would just stack to solid, not perfect, games then I’d be encouraged.
Matt.harris
I like that Jahns is skipping the Denial step in the Chicago Bears Quarterback Stages of Grief:
Excitement / Hell yes, we finally got one!
Denial / It’s a work in progress.
Doubt / No way this is happening, right? Right??
Anger / How is this fucking happening again?!
Resignation / God hates me.
ryan wetnight ii
1. The Ravens went with a heavy box 61% of the time and dared Caleb to beat them. The result was the Bears scoring 13 points through 3.5 quarters. Not good.
2. The next game will really test the the Bears passing game. A week pass rush + 3 of the top 4 Bears CBs being out against an elite receiver duo = lots of Bengals points.
3. Remember when Dexter was good at rushing the passer? He had a 0% pressure rate last week. Also, has the lowest hurries per snap number of his career.
4. Odeyingbo and his $20M/year salary is a joke, and it is time for Poles to catch heat for it. 87th in total pressures. 78th in total QB hits. On pace for 2 sacks and just 7 run stuffs this season. It is almost Claypool-esque.